Leading trainer the target of undercover investigator
WITH a second Four Corners program focused on greyhound racing expected to air in the near future, there is speculation Animals Australia, Animal Liberation Queensland and the RSPCA might have further footage of trainers engaging in live-baiting activities.
Now, a leading Victorian trainer has confirmed to Australian Racing Greyhound that their training establishment was targeted by the same undercover spy who appeared in the ABC's Four Corners program focusing on live-baiting.
The trainer, who has not been named due to the serious circumstances of the live-baiting saga, said a woman known as ‘Jane' was working for them at the end of 2014 for a short period.
They were told ‘Jane' had worked for her family on a farm in England before meeting her at a racetrack where she asked for weekend work. She was given normal duties such as feeding pups and cleaning kennels before suspicions grew when she begun asking about their bullring and how the dogs were taught to chase.
But that wasn't the only strange thing about ‘Jane'…
“Even on really warm days she would be covered in clothing and wearing a hat and we used to say that she had a hunchback,” the trainer said.
It is unknown whether the clothing may have been worn to conceal a camera or recording device, while the trainer is still unsure as to whether any secret surveillance cameras were ever set up or still remain on their property.
“It is hard to know (whether cameras were set up) but hopefully she has gone away satisfied that everything is alright here.”
The trainer says there is no doubt in their mind the woman working for them was the same person who went undercover at the property of Zeke Kadir, despite the fact her face was blurred on the Four Corner's program.
“We recognised her on Four Corners, it didn't show her face but it was definitely her,” they said.
The trainer said that irregardless of whether trainers are obeying by the rules of racing or not, it acts as a reminder for all participants to be wary of who they allow on their properties.
“You have got to be carful of who you have around, we will be very careful of anyone we have around here from now on.”
The trainer says that the covert investigations, conducted by Animals Australia and Animal Liberation Queensland, which have targeted multiple training establishments around the country, had the wrong intentions from the start.
“It has been bad for the whole industry the way that it has all been done – they want to get rid of greyhound racing completely, they are not interested in just trying to catch those people doing the wrong thing.”
Australian Racing Greyhound is led to believe that no further footage has been handed to Greyhound Racing Victoria. It is hoped this indicates any additional surveillance gathered during the investigations of other premises showed no wrongdoing by those trainers. If further damning footage does come to light, it may raise question about the motives of the animal welfare organisations and as to why it was concealed for so long.
Katherine thanks again for your informative articles. The welfare seems very selective about what graphics they show. In the horrific Toovey case in Western Australia the welfare came across unbelievable horror of welfare carers abandoning dogs including a greyhound who starved to death in 2012 and two other carer dogs which had to be put down. The matter went to court recently and the court decided that Toovey should be barred from handling animals for five years and serve 800 hours community service. The greyhound agency decided that the greyhound community had three times to public interest in the welfafe… Read more »
“The trainer says that the covert investigations, conducted by Animals Australia and Animal Liberation Queensland, which have targeted multiple training establishments around the country, had the wrong intentions from the start.” I’m going to go out on a limb here and suggest that maybe people committing hoffic acts of animal cruelty may in fact have been the ones with the wrong intentions. “If further damning footage does come to light, it may raise question about the motives of the animal welfare organisations and as to why it was concealed for so long. ” On drugs Katherine? Would you rather your… Read more »
Typical T.V. only show the bad stuff. Most people do the right thing.
How about they broadcast the covert footage where they found no evidence of wrong doing? Oh that’s right, wouldn’t earn them any dollars would it. Donate, donate, donate, that’s what it’s all about. They do it in the poultry and pork industry, break in to peoples properties until they find one industry member who breaches codes. They then flood the media with footage from that one establishment and claim the breaches are widespread. Then they ask for more donations to stop further abuse. A good little money spinner.
@AaronC Well balanced reply particularly “If further damning footage does come to light, it may raise question about the motives of the animal welfare organisations and as to why it was concealed for so long. ” The NSW and Victorian acts have an emphasis on the Prevention of cruelty to animals. There are matters that might suggest that the prevention of cruelty to animals breaches might include others. We don’t have to worry too much about this in NSW as we have a former high court judge heading the task force and our board and CEO have gone into voluntary… Read more »
If you have done nothing wrong you will have nothing to worry about. Simple.
irregardless – not a real word – it’s jargon/colloqiualism and as it’s not in quotation marks I presume that this is your error. Very poor grammar. The content is equally dodgy, You seem to be suggesting that the crime is being caught out, not actually committing the criminal act.
Unfairly Tarred Showing instances of no cruelty doesn’t erase the instances of sick depraved psychopathic cruelty, you know.
What you people don’t seem to understand, is that the action of these investigators is what was required to get anything done about these welfare breaches. While it may be true that animal rights groups would like to see greyhound racing gone altogether, what they have exposed, which is organised animal cruelty, is something that the community at large wants to see abolished. Without these investigations, this cruelty would still be going on unchecked because the regulatory systems in place were woefully inadequate. Jason Mackay has at least admitted that he heard rumours of live baiting at Tom Noble’s property,… Read more »
@AaronC Unfairly Tarred Duck shooting season starts shortly.
Unfairly Tarred This wasn’t one industry member breaking the rules, so that’s an idiotic argument to make. Would also be interested in you directing us towards a similar campaign be animal rights groups that is based upon a “single incident”. And as AaronC has said, showing that the majority are doing things correctly is irrelevant, the goal is to remove instances of people doing things incorrectly. Are you saying that as long as the issue is in the minority then it’s ok? Where do you draw the line? 10%, 20%, 40%? As long as over 50% are in the right… Read more »
Unfairly Tarred What is that comment even supposed to mean? Are you expressing excitement at the opportunity to kill? Or are you suggesting that shooting an animal for sport, where the death is quick is the same as an animal being wounded repeatedly over a prolonged period while it slowly dies? Not to mention that one of these things is LEGAL and one of these things is ILLEGAL.
Hugh_ Unfairly Tarred So what is the percentage Hugh
, 7,000 trainers, how many live baiters caught? Huge problem? How about some balance in reporting. Have no sympathy for anyone caught. They are caught, done and dusted. Meanwhile, every honest trainer gets tagged with the continuing BS!
John Tracey John – Aaron Cross has never presented a balanced reply when it comes to racing.
Hugh_ Unfairly Tarred LOL too funny Hugh. Don’t own a gun. Hugh/Aaron/whoever. The ambulance chasers will move on, new target, more donations.
Unfairly Tarred Hugh_ I’ll make this point again. Live baiting was common knowledge, but was tolerated. Don’t you think that if you aren’t motivated to clean up your own sport then you have to accept some backlash when someone does it for you? You have to shoulder some responsibility for allowing these breaches to occur. The industry was SELF REGULATED, that puts the responsibility for these failings ON THE INDUSTRY. I work in scientific research, we do animal experimentation and we are held to strict ethics guidelines. If I had even the slight suspicion that someone in my building or institute… Read more »
Unfairly Tarred Hugh_ I didn’t accuse you of owning a gun, I was just trying to guess at the motives behind your ambiguous statement. Admittedly, I shouldn’t care, I guess I’m too easily drawn into debates.
Hugh_ Unfairly Tarred Common knowledge no, hearsay yes.
Unfairly Tarred Hugh_ Ok fine, you can call it that if you prefer. Let’s say “commonly rumoured”. That’s still enough to warrant action. As I said, if there was hearsay of ethics breaches that I was aware of in my industry, I would act. If you’re being honest, a large amount of people assumed this practice WAS occurring with some level of frequency (this is my understanding from vets that I know and people involved in PE drug detection). Using the excuse of not having specific knowledge of the individuals involved doesn’t give the industry a free pass to do nothing… Read more »
Animals gained rights against cruelty in NSW from 1901 and blooding of greyhounds in training has been unlawful since this date.. A defence for cruelty to animals has been things like necessary cruelty like poisoning rodents and vermin. Live hare coursing was lawful up until 1953 and the Governor previously regulated hares in captivity to the used in coursing. In most of the other States cruelty to animals excluded rodents and vermin which had no rights under cruelty provisions so the rules now show an evolution in cultures towards animal kindness. The early prevention of cruelty to animals legislation is… Read more »
Sorry I am too slow to edit my posts.
What I wanted to say to the NSW posters is that the task force in NSW will answer the questions that everyone is asking or debating. It is difficult to work out what is going on in the other states but in some cases their cultures are more embedded in the blood sport coursing and in some cases they were able in various periods to legally blood greyhounds with rodents and vermin.
John Tracey Well I’m up in QLD and I have no doubt changing the culture here will be harder than in most places, we are already overrun by the bogan element. People growing up being taught it’s ok to torture cane toads has no doubt grown the extent to which the average person is comfortable with animal cruelty.
Anyone who donates to ALQ should reconsider their donations I would not give them the stream off my /:-;$&.
Todman insightful
Hugh_ John Tracey arguably cane toads have rights under welfare acts. From a national economic view point it would be better financially to the country if breaches of the welfare acts led to jail time for Queensland offenders as the jail maximum under the blooding provisions is only one year and the cost to the community for jailing the offenders is the lowest day rates in the nation (under two hundred per day).
Katherine thanks again for your informative articles. The welfare seems very selective about what graphics they show. In the horrific Toovey case in Western Australia the welfare came across unbelievable horror of welfare carers abandoning dogs including a greyhound who starved to death in 2012 and two other carer dogs which had to be put down. The matter went to court recently and the court decided that Toovey should be barred from handling animals for five years and serve 800 hours community service. The greyhound agency decided that the greyhound community had three times to public interest in the welfare… Read more »
“The trainer says that the covert investigations, conducted by Animals Australia and Animal Liberation Queensland, which have targeted multiple training establishments around the country, had the wrong intentions from the start.” I’m going to go out on a limb here and suggest that maybe people committing hoffic acts of animal cruelty may in fact have been the ones with the wrong intentions. “If further damning footage does come to light, it may raise question about the motives of the animal welfare organisations and as to why it was concealed for so long. ” On drugs Katherine? Would you rather your… Read more »
Typical T.V. only show the bad stuff. Most people do the right thing.
How about they broadcast the covert footage where they found no evidence of wrong doing? Oh that’s right, wouldn’t earn them any dollars would it. Donate, donate, donate, that’s what it’s all about. They do it in the poultry and pork industry, break in to peoples properties until they find one industry member who breaches codes. They then flood the media with footage from that one establishment and claim the breaches are widespread. Then they ask for more donations to stop further abuse. A good little money spinner.
@AaronC Well balanced reply particularly “If further damning footage does come to light, it may raise question about the motives of the animal welfare organisations and as to why it was concealed for so long. ” The NSW and Victorian acts have an emphasis on the Prevention of cruelty to animals. There are matters that might suggest that the prevention of cruelty to animals breaches might include others. We don’t have to worry too much about this in NSW as we have a former high court judge heading the task force and our board and CEO have gone into voluntary… Read more »
If you have done nothing wrong you will have nothing to worry about. Simple.
irregardless – not a real word – it’s jargon/colloqiualism and as it’s not in quotation marks I presume that this is your error. Very poor grammar. The content is equally dodgy, You seem to be suggesting that the crime is being caught out, not actually committing the criminal act.
Unfairly Tarred Showing instances of no cruelty doesn’t erase the instances of sick depraved psychopathic cruelty, you know.
What you people don’t seem to understand, is that the action of these investigators is what was required to get anything done about these welfare breaches. While it may be true that animal rights groups would like to see greyhound racing gone altogether, what they have exposed, which is organised animal cruelty, is something that the community at large wants to see abolished. Without these investigations, this cruelty would still be going on unchecked because the regulatory systems in place were woefully inadequate. Jason Mackay has at least admitted that he heard rumours of live baiting at Tom Noble’s property,… Read more »
@AaronC Unfairly Tarred Duck shooting season starts shortly.
Unfairly Tarred This wasn’t one industry member breaking the rules, so that’s an idiotic argument to make. Would also be interested in you directing us towards a similar campaign by animal rights groups that is based upon a “single incident”, because I’m yet to see it. And as AaronC has said, showing that the majority are doing things correctly is irrelevant, the goal is to remove instances of people doing things incorrectly. Are you saying that as long as the issue is in the minority then it’s ok? Where do you draw the line? 10%, 20%, 40%? As long as… Read more »
An undercover investigation really would pay off if a lead trainer were to be found using steroids. Although it probably happens more often that people think, it should still be investigated. It would just make more sense if the investigation wasn’t undercover. If someone is doing something illegal, there is probably an easier way to find out.
Unfairly Tarred What is that comment even supposed to mean? Are you expressing excitement at the opportunity to kill? Or are you suggesting that shooting an animal for sport, where the death is quick is the same as an animal being wounded repeatedly over a prolonged period while it slowly dies? Not to mention that one of these things is LEGAL and one of these things is ILLEGAL.
Hugh_ Unfairly Tarred So what is the percentage Hugh
, 7,000 trainers, how many live baiters caught? Huge problem? How about some balance in reporting. Have no sympathy for anyone caught. They are caught, done and dusted. Meanwhile, every honest trainer gets tagged with the continuing BS!
John Tracey John – Aaron Cross has never presented a balanced reply when it comes to racing.
Hugh_ Unfairly Tarred LOL too funny Hugh. Don’t own a gun. Hugh/Aaron/whoever. The ambulance chasers will move on, new target, more donations.
Unfairly Tarred Hugh_ I don’t know what the percentage is, but there were a lot of people caught in that documentary and they were at the top of the sport, so do the math, it’s hardly a “tiny minority”. And besides, it shouldn’t be happening at all. I’ll make this point again. Live baiting was common knowledge, but was tolerated. Don’t you think that if you aren’t motivated to clean up your own sport then you have to accept some backlash when someone does it for you? You have to shoulder some responsibility for allowing these breaches to occur. The industry was… Read more »
Unfairly Tarred Hugh_ I didn’t accuse you of owning a gun, I was just trying to guess at the motives behind your ambiguous statement. Admittedly, I shouldn’t care, I guess I’m too easily drawn into debates.
Hugh_ Unfairly Tarred Common knowledge no, hearsay yes.
Unfairly Tarred Hugh_ Ok fine, you can call it that if you prefer. Let’s say “commonly rumoured”. That’s still enough to warrant action. As I said, if there was hearsay of ethics breaches that I was aware of in my industry, I would act. If you’re being honest, a large amount of people assumed this practice WAS occurring with some level of frequency (this is my understanding from vets that I know and people involved in PE drug detection). Using the excuse of not having specific knowledge of the individuals involved doesn’t give the industry a free pass to do nothing… Read more »
Animals gained rights against cruelty in NSW from 1901 and blooding of greyhounds in training has been unlawful since this date.. A defence for cruelty to animals has been things like necessary cruelty like poisoning rodents and vermin. Live hare coursing was lawful up until 1953 and the Governor previously regulated hares in captivity to the used in coursing. In most of the other States cruelty to animals excluded rodents and vermin which had no rights under cruelty provisions so the rules now show an evolution in cultures towards animal kindness. The early prevention of cruelty to animals legislation is… Read more »
Sorry I am too slow to edit my posts.
What I wanted to say to the NSW posters is that the task force in NSW will answer the questions that everyone is asking or debating. It is difficult to work out what is going on in the other states but in some cases their cultures are more embedded in the blood sport coursing and in some cases they were able in various periods to legally blood greyhounds with rodents and vermin.
John Tracey Well I’m up in QLD and I have no doubt changing the culture here will be harder than in most places, we are already overrun by the bogan element. People growing up being taught it’s ok to torture cane toads has no doubt grown the extent to which the average person is comfortable with animal cruelty.
Anyone who donates to ALQ should reconsider their donations I would not give them the stream off my /:-;$&.
Todman insightful