What has the greyhound industry learned from the ban?
IT has been a tumultuous year for the sport of greyhound racing in New South Wales.
Things seemed to be looking up following on from the live baiting scandal in 2015. A wide range of reforms were introduced to optimise animal welfare and integrity conditions and participants became more aware of the requirements needed for the sport to meet community expectations.
Breeding was down, rehoming was up, and yet none of this was taken into consideration on July 7 when Mike Baird announced his government's plan to shut down the sport.
Looking back, I don't think there is anyway the Premier could have known what an enormous impact his announcement would have.
The son of a politician, Mr Baird lives in a different world to greyhound folk, and paired with his cohort of north shore Liberals and inner city Greens, how could they relate to the day-to-day lives of the industry's battlers?
Teamed with this, the Special Commission of Inquiry report was damning, especially to those who had no reason to believe it was prejudiced.
Imagine not knowing anything about an industry and then being told of those horrific figures – up to 70 per cent wastage and as many as 68,000 dogs killed over the past 12 years.
Since then, the industry has been able to prove bias within the report and discredit many of those figures, however when your government spends 15 months and $15 million on a report, Baird was doomed to insult, no matter what his next move was.
Deputy Premier Troy Grant's move to back the Premier was painful for the industry. As the leader of the Nationals, Grant should have stood up for his regional constituents, however it was left to three brave Nats MPs to cross the floor in August in order to send a message to the government that it's decision was the wrong one.
Thankfully, the industry was able to rally, and with public and political pressure, the Premier backflipped on his original decision. But where to next?
When announcing the reversal on October 11, the Premier also confirmed the establishment of a newly-formed Greyhound Industry Reform Panel.
Made up of five members, only one of those is from the greyhound industry (the GBOTA's Brenton Scott), with the others being from the RSPCA, the Department of the Premier, the Department of Primary Industries and, of course, former Premier Morris Iemma.
But can the industry feel safe with these people in charge?
The RSPCA celebrated the announcement that the industry was being banned back in July, whilst the day after the reversal was made official, another message was shared on the group's Facebook page, urging the Premier to ‘Bring Back the Ban'.
Since then, this post has been deleted and replaced with another message from RSPCA NSW CEO Steve Coleman announcing he will be a part of the panel.
However, part of this post also expressed disappointment in the change in policy.
Whilst agreeing that animal welfare needs to be front and centre for the industry moving forward, how can the sport reform with people working on the inside who have publicly campaigned against it?
It would be like employing a vegan to manage a knackery — personal beliefs are always going to create a bias — it just won't work.
The panel needed an independent person who is passionate about animal welfare, not an animal rights organisation such as the RSPCA — there is a big difference.
In essence, animal welfare ensures living creatures are cared for following a range of humane guidelines – whereas animal rights dictates animals cannot be used for food, clothing or entertainment – no matter how well they are nurtured.
It's hard to believe the RSPCA will ever do anything other than condemn greyhound racing – no matter how many reforms are successfully undertaken.
And yet the organisation has now been tethered to the industry.
Add this to the fact that the industry has one representative up against two government appointed members, one former Premier and an anti-racing mob.
It's four against one from the outset and it is arguable the sole agent for the dishlickers isn't even a true representative for the entire cross section of greyhound racing.
While Brenton Scott has done a fine job campaigning for the ban to be overturned as a part of the NSW Greyhound Racing Industry Alliance, at the end of the day he is the CEO of the NSW Greyhound Breeders, Owners and Trainers Association (GBOTA).
While it is a member-based association, the GBOTA's main responsibility is managing a selection of racetracks – so where does the individual fit into the equation? Who will look after the trainers, owners and participants, particularly those not linked to the GBOTA, and make sure their thoughts and ideas are taken into consideration?
And what about transparency? Will the industry and public have any idea in regards to what is being discussed about the industry before recommendations and restrictions are decided upon? Or will we just have to deal with what we are dealt?
The industry has not had a racing board since it was removed following the live baiting scandal. I understand the structure of the sport may change dramatically at the end of the panel's work, but in the interim we should have one to protect the needs of the whole industry, not just a sector, and this board should have been represented on the panel to ensure every man, woman and greyhound had their interests covered.
Don't get me wrong, I am very thankful that the industry has been given another crack and I do think things need to change, particularly in regards to animal welfare and integrity.
However, I am very concerned about what has been set in place already and what will be decided for the future.
Call me a pessimist, call me a troublemaker, but it would be wrong for me to sit back and say nothing when I hold these concerns.
By speaking out, I hope to send a message that the industry is tired of being walked over.
Here's hoping the government is finally ready to listen.
lone widow Deborah555 spyman John Tracey Hugh_ jeff holland The ABC 1000 the tele says 500 that’s still 2000 less than our protest and we didn’t get a single picture in the ABC. I checked the crowd just the usual middle age housewives with nothing to do now the kids have left home, young idealist left wing lesbians and the lone male ( friendless and now a world leading authority because he has adopted a greyhound the usual rent a crowd. I did send my apologies to Mehreen about being unable to attend this prestigious event and asked what she is doing about horse wastage… Read more »
jeff holland John Tracey Hugh_ lone widow
6 dog fields,and pre determined box positions,and NO DAMN CORNER STARTS…..simplistic.
spyman jeff holland John Tracey Hugh_ lone widow plus lone widows track design and we are laughing.
Deborah555 spyman jeff holland John Tracey Hugh_ lone widow
trying to save moolah Deborah. start with the least financial,and keep breaking down until its done right..have no doubt proper cambers and one turns are the way to go,but are we in that good a financial position? all ideas are better than sitting on our bums.
spyman Deborah555 jeff holland John Tracey Hugh_ lone widow great ideas spyman I totally agree but hell why not be greedy especially now welfare is in the picture you just never know your luck. A good bloke on a grader could sort some of tracks in a few hours but you are absolutely right with the views that all a great place to start and costs are less I understand that.
What have we learnt from the ban- well 34 greyhound people just beat two animal activists to the comments page of the telegraphs latest story ( bless all those at the Telegraph paper) so I think we have learnt about the power of social media and making a noise.
spyman jeff holland John Tracey Hugh_ lone widow Would you consider handicapped races on corners, it works in athletics. Box designs have not changed much in 70 years only refinements along the same theme. Also would the use of drones be made available this would allow a better predetermined route taking into account the geography of the track ie in some places the hare could be in a wider position rather than reshaping a track. I like the way the outside hare works on some UK tracks it seems to work on hexagonal type of outside rails. A drone could be programmed to run… Read more »
Hugh_ lone widow spyman Deborah555 Great contribution. The people on the ground are always ahead of the administrators when it comes to the welfare of anything. The greyhound people are more interested in animal welfare that the general public as they have voted to be a part of it. So the only real consideration is focus. I did a survey years ago on the posts on Global Greyhounds. Of the top twenty posts over many years eighteen of them could be classified as concerning animal welfare. There is a definite connection between animal welfare and economics but unless their is a focus on… Read more »
John Tracey Hugh_ lone widow spyman Deborah555 John, i remember as a child in the 1950’s travelling from the suburbs of Sydney (Auburn) to the city by train on a saturday and you would get any number of trainers and greyhounds on the train on their way to Wentworth Park for a nights racing. (Racing dogs must be a constitutional right by now)? On another point you make the only reason dogs other than competing greyhounds are not allowed at the venue on race nights that i know of is they could disrupt the race if they got away from their owner during the… Read more »
John Tracey Hugh_ spyman Deborah555 PS. Sorry John it’s late i’m slowing down in my old age.
Deborah555 lone widow spyman John Tracey Hugh_ jeff holland It is a mistake to not respect the size of the protest. Significantly it is a protest in the City and not in the Country. I notice that the animal action group are not standing at Orange. The protest will probably cause a further division between Country and City interests. The City interests in greyhound racing need to be accommodated as well, it is a complex situation which needs management. It is a tough one in my estimation.
After reading this opinion piece, I do not believe any actual “learning” happened.
kctipton wow, a psychic. and you have witnessed this personally? or do you read tea leaves as well.
u r the first person I ever have seen can predict what is happening,probably on any subject,simply by reading other peoples comments. god damn,i am impressed.
Deborah555 LOL……….victory. god bless the Daily Telegrapgh.and Hadley/jones/murray/foley/Hodgkinson/murray(he gets 2 votes cos he went to the people)and all the others who got involved,and of course. THE PEOPLE.
kctipton Fair comment, the opinion piece is about what the Government have learned about the Ban rather than what Greyhound Racing has but the piece still encourages debate and the moderator of the debate allows a free flow of ideas one way or another. The grass roots of greyhound racing have a sharp focus on welfare matters and this is what excites them here and on other greyhound sites. The lesson to be learned in my opinion is to accept there is a “social licence” in every endeavour and eventually the public interest (social licence) drives the commercial interest as… Read more »
Deborah555 lone widow jeff holland John Tracey Hugh_ Leave box 5 vacant, next problem?.
Hugh_ lone widow spyman Deborah555 Hugh i believe like you and majority of Greyhound people love animals of all kinds. I read with interest that your against Animal Exploitation for money, i recently spoke to a former compliance officer with the RSPCA and i was shocked at what he told us.He stated that only 10% of their income of around 100 million dollars actuality goes to caring of the Animals while in their care! wouldn’t you agree that’s a form of animal exploitation by the leading welfare group here in in Australia ?
lone widow Deborah555 spyman John Tracey Hugh_ jeff holland Needs a counter suggest the greyhound industry conference at Wentworth Park in late Nov early DEc has a heavy animal welfare item focus. A picture is worth a thousand words.
John Tracey Deborah555 lone widow spyman Hugh_ jeff holland John I think the bizarre nature of some of the protestors costumes etc has done them more harm than good. I agree these fanatics will not stop but I think they may have lost some credibility during all this.
Deborah555 John Tracey spyman Hugh_ There was some research that showed that women avoided greyhound meetings at night for security considerations but also they did not like seeing dogs crashing on the first turns. The way to improve greyhound welfare is probably to encourage more woman to it so for this reason alone something should be done. Administrators dont like dealing with woman. The biggest protest from participants when I was on the board was from the woman who controlled various traks in the rural area. They were enraged when the evacuation policy (following 9/11) only catered for participants not the greyhounds. I… Read more »
lone widow John Tracey Hugh_ spyman Deborah555 We are talking t cross purposes but you re mentioning a dimension that could be considered. I am talking about the greyhounds entered on the night or day for an event and being allowed to celebrate or being held joined by the connection. Just on the subject of events in the Rural areas where both dogs are part of the promotion both kennelled and un-kennelled ie the Brood bitch challenge at Young 12 offical races kennelled and 21 heats of fields of 4 aged greyhounds (time trials) kept in dedicated areas un kennelled (with some trial kennels… Read more »
John Tracey Deborah555 spyman Hugh_ Yes I am always happy to see some women when I get to the track not that I have ever been treated with anything less than respect by any male trainers it is just that you feel more comfortable when a couple of your women friends are there. It is always good to have a balance most men are more practical and realistic about welfare and a lot of women are protected from the harsher side of life by the men in their lives who do the “tough stuff”. I doubt whether too many men who work at the… Read more »
Hugh_ lone widow spyman Deborah555 Hugh, what you have missed on the hypocrisy front is the wide disparity of views of what cruelty actually is. For example take the photos of yesterdays march in Sydney, none of the dogs were enjoying the day, and you may not have noted but when greyhound people held their march, they didnt bring their dogs, we didnt use them as props for the media, we werent that cruel. And then there is the treatment of dogs by many who have them as pets. For mine confining a greyhound to a flat, never allowing it to gallop is… Read more »
Deborah555 John Tracey lone widow spyman Hugh_ jeff holland I think that if anyone mentioned greyhounds in the ear shot of the Premier he would take out a restraining order against them. The animal welfare protest is payback to the Premier and it shows the lack of human decency can overtake people who have allied previously with the Premier when it suited them and have deserted him when he is in a difficult position. Call me old fashioned but loyalty gets a lot of points with me and the anti-greyhound lobby has no loyalty to the Premier. However, any popular protest carries dangers so the… Read more »
kctipton wow,i at last have met someone who can predict by reading a forum piece! that is now considered staggering.or have you researched and delved and spoken with many,outside of that piece and this forum,to form such a pro response by yourself? I would be happy to meet and shake your hand,as u would be the first since the back flip,to have taken one step forward.the rest of us are stagnating behind,but we will follow u. me thinks not. a lot of work to be done yet before anyone,and I mean anyone,can confidently predict any changes or progress has been… Read more »
spyman kctipton kc your latest post on another site contains hearsay and unproved allegations , only to willing to have a serious conversation with you but it has to be better than psychobabble. Do you agree that Hilmer reforms (such as the greyhound ones) need to include the principals of competitive neutrality. Control boards should need to prove they are competitive when taking over commercial tasks. This action would do away with the conflicts of interest and deliver productivity gains that could be used for animal welfare. I noticed that the greyhounds at the protest were in much better condition than… Read more »
John Tracey Deborah555 lone widow spyman Hugh_ jeff holland I fail to see how supporting a decision you agree with and then protesting against that decision when it’s reversed shows a lack of decency. Blind loyalty is not a virtue. Why should the anti-greyhound lobby have loyalty to Baird anyway? The coalition is the worst of the major parties when it comes to advancing animal welfare, most people who want to improve the conditions for animals in Australia do not vote liberal or national, and Baird’s decision to ban greyhound racing came as a surprise to everyone. There was never loyalty to Baird, he simply… Read more »
I think that I have learned through Mad Panda that we need to work our own rescue schemes on our own tracks as frankly the external services in the main are not good enough for us. see cut and past from another site. John Tracey3 minutes ago Mad Panda Hi you are using an emotional response to make your case. I have read your activity posts and agree with this item cut and paste. “The industry better start taking care of their own (dogs) and not lean on the community groups to do their dirty work.” I agree totally I would… Read more »
Also I have learned that a lot of the two turn tracks were designed to race with an outside hare so when we are are doing in reshaping and cambering tracks is making them suitable for the hare technology. With the advance in technology it would be easy to program the lure on or off an arm to move to the side as well as forward (retraction etc). The other codes have made serious advancements in safety with rails so why cant we. If the Gardens (Newcastle) had have used an outside hare they would not have had to pul… Read more »
jeff holland Hugh_ The idea that my arguments in favour of extending empathy to animals is akin to religion is ridiculous. Just because you describe something as a “belief” does not imply a standard level of evidence to support that belief. Religions assert the existence of invisible omniscient beings for which there is no evidence, and then make moral arguments based on the instructions of these invisible beings. This is irrational and not similar to saying, for example, that you believe in evolution, which is supported by a huge body of empirical evidence. I argue that animals feel pain and suffer… Read more »
BobWhitelaw Hugh_ lone widow spyman Deborah555 Bob which state was this in or do you mean nationally? I’m a little reluctant to form any judgement based on one claim read in the comments page on this website. I previously looked at the RSPCA’s financial statement in QLD briefly and that is not the impression that I got. If the RSPCA is not doing a good job of directing the most money they can towards activities that benefit animals then I would of course be critical of that. If that were the case then I would say they are exploiting people rather than animals since… Read more »
Hugh_ John Tracey Deborah555 lone widow spyman jeff holland Loyalty in family and politics is a virtue and sometimes it can be blind but the situation I am talking about is not blind. The Greens have run with a political campaign on animal welfare and in a previous life they backed greyhound racing as a grass root activity. The blooding of greyhounds has been known to the political parties from the creation of the Greens (Glebe1984 NSW) The Greens were more supportive of the developments at Wentworth Park than the Labor Party branches in the area on their grass roots preferences (see their early manifesto.)… Read more »
John Tracey Hugh_ Deborah555 lone widow spyman jeff holland Your original comment was about the “anti-greyhound lobby”, which I assumed to mean those most dedicated to ending greyhound racing, which is largely members of the public. I wouldn’t consider that to be synonymous with the Greens.
I have mixed feelings about the Greens, they have some several policy positions that I prefer to the major parties but many that I do not.
Hugh_ BobWhitelaw lone widow spyman Deborah555 Sage Advice, I use the RSPCA stats as a microcosm as research background for marketing and promotion for a welfare scheme we having been trying to get up at Gunnedah for over two decades. I think that the RSPCA does a great job with the monies they receive but from the greyhound point of view if they are raising money using the visibility of Greyhound Racing to raise money from donators that believe they are contributing to the welfare of greyhounds and the monies are generally being spent on welfare elsewhere then there is an imbalance. I would… Read more »
John Tracey John. tracks that we vision today,were designed for close up patronage and viewing.hence the grandstands and restaurants etc;. that was fine before things like sky and that progressed into the fast lanes of entertainment. ask ourselves this question. who really goes to watch the dogs anymore? apart from main events,attendance ,apart from trainers and owners and a few staff, is way down and the infrastructure is not utilised completely. food is of poor quality on basic meetings,again unless its a major night/day cup or whatever,so why not seriously consider,that tracks need to be designed to cater for the… Read more »
Hugh_ John Tracey Deborah555 lone widow spyman jeff holland Sorry I see the lobby in organisational terms.My post was not clear sorry. I agree with you as to the public that supported the rally they are expressing their views and power to them. We have had a suicide of a youth in the family not to do with greyhounds but similar in effect to people driven by emotional overload on a young impressional mind. I don’t want to go further but none of us should think tht our cause leads to the above result. Just back to the loyalty issue. To be loyal to yourself… Read more »
spyman John Tracey My point is that we are looking at the racetrack as producer of racing images and not as an entertainment. The old days used to include a range of other promotions. Here is a cut and paste of the Bulli Show grounds which is like show grounds owned by the Greyhound Freehold . The Bulli show ground is owned and controlled by the Council (in committee) cut and past. WollongongCouncil owns the showground and Bulli Greyhounds pays rent to the council. Thereis a sub-lease agreement to run things on the site with a Sub Committee of 6members but… Read more »
John Tracey spyman as an add on John,i recall the days at Sandown,where Afghan/Saluki/Jack Russel/whippet races were help by the appropriate clubs. I even remember athletics races over 100mtrs and 400mtr events being held. these are possible add ons that could be utilised on a race day/night. I know one chap at Temora, who did this type of thing just recently where local footy clubs,netball clubs,and so on,would come and have a great night doing their competitive thing against each other.there are so many possibilities during a dog meeting,and yes,by all means utilise tracks for other peoples usages like you quoted.… Read more »
spyman John Tracey Great Ideas, Exotics will attract crowds and also people who want to adopt greyhounds. On a linked Greyhound track program you can also get the effect of novelty that guarantee increase in crowds at different locations. The original monkey’s on greyhound promotions were run by a company and attracted great crowds initially at White City Vic Mascot and Newcastle NSW. The Camel races attracted 6,000 to the Harold Park Trots but only as a first time novelty. The Camel Races at Forbes get big crowds on Good Friday at Easter. Kite The annual ferret races in transparent tubing… Read more »
John Tracey jeff holland Hugh_ lone widow Sorry just re reading the post and the stuff in brackets does not read right so I need to leave it out (my computer. The one problem with small fields is change words) One problem with small fields is equivalent to trialling dogs in small fields that is they are likely to go about .3 of a second faster. The faster an animal travels the more potential it has for injury, particularly hair (greenstick) injury ) A ten year study of racehorses came to the same conclusion. Hare stick injuries can be missed in X-rays so… Read more »
John Tracey spyman takes just the one step to get things in motion John. where to?
lone widow John Tracey Hugh_ spyman Deborah555 Hi Look after yourself, rabies in dogs is exotic to Australia but one dog eat an infected bat but apparently did not pass on the virus. There were two humans infected from overseas entering Australia with the virus. Someone running an eating place told me that the restrictions on dogs was to avoid rabies but as this is the only explanation I have ever got that made some sense I accepted it. I think it is a throw away to the old conditions where dogs run loose on the streets.
BobWhitelaw Deborah555 Sorry I gave you the wrong information on the process. People keep referring the greyhound ACT as a BILL. A bill is like a motion prior to becoming a resolution. The Greyhound Ban Act also amend the Greyhound Racing Act 2009 and makes the position of Administrator and the sacking of the board under legislative rules. This does not negate a responsibility to reverse the ban and amend the Act quickly as suggested but it makes more complex to do it. A number of Acts need to be debated and re-issued in a new form. My preference is to… Read more »
Iaah have learned that over regulation and legislation can kill any enterprise so I put foresrd the following. 1.Get equality through the future fund not the inter code agreement. Playing with the inter code agreement will send you blind. 2.Once you accept the above the rest is easy because the 1998 amendment act facilitated the above and also involved consultants who were involved in a million dollar success fee.The million to one change of dusty service orientated public servants improving the first act did not come off. Simply amend the existing act and have the biggest party in history and… Read more »
John Tracey
1.Get equality through the future fund not the inter code agreement. Playing with the inter code agreement will send you blind.
John,me thinks u know something along this line?whispers are directed at that exact point.interesting hey?
spyman John Tracey Yes its around in many places, as recommendations and in discussions. I put it up at the time of the TAB float originally but the Government at the time were unwilling to return to a future fund. The future fund now is a lot larger than the previous one from (1973 to 1997). I wont go into further details as the matter will be played out at the higher levels.We can probably keep you informed further but probably the matter now should be restricted so if this site allows personal contact between parties I could keep people informed… Read more »
John Tracey spyman John Tracey spyman John, I think it is a topic that needs to be discussed,but so many people would want to be informed. I get annoyed at some comments on forums that are more about destruction of the industry,when one knows that it is not as noted on a forum. some have a sense of thinking they know what is taking place,and comment from their own minds,and that can be like guessing in a way.what that does,is set a poor standard for the hard work going on behind the scenes. like the court cases that were coming a few… Read more »
spyman John Tracey Hi spyman thanks for getting back to me on my posts. I agree with most of what you are saying. My only objection to posters is that I don’t want to spend much time with people who are comfortable with being victims and have given up. These people have made their accommodation in life and their only ambition is to pull everyone else in with them. They will double cross everything you try to do progressively. This is a hard comment and it applies across the board. This being said the people who stay in the fight or… Read more »
spyman John Tracey We are preparing a report to be presented to the NSW GRCA (country clubs) special general meeting to be held in conjunction with the GBOTA annual meeting on a date to be advised in late November of early December. Subject to approval, amendment etc of the recommendations will be forwarded to the powers to be.
Also we will be seeking guest speakers from all areas to assist the process. (infrastructure, marketing and promotion, tourism etc)
lone widow Hugh_ spyman Deborah555 Interesting that you say that, does this mean you feel that the industry may not have improved welfare standards sufficiently if not for the threat of the ban? If that’s true, do you think you are in the minority or the majority of industry participants by feeling that welfare standards/protections were not strong enough?