Racing integrity commissions based on hope alone
WE may have gone as far as we can in discussing welfare and breeding issues. In any event, I find it annoying to be verballed so regularly, and to note so many extravagant statements made by people who do not state their qualifications. There is also an urge to pick out one bad apple and use it to underpin future policy decisions – hardly productive methodology.
Even so, I am going to make one last comment on one of “Hugh's” opinions, partly because it is a reasonably fresh subject. He said, “However I do think that an independent regulator is, in principle, a hugely positive step when it comes to safeguarding animal welfare. The temptation to give into profit maximising practices at the expense of animal welfare is too great.”
I bring that up for five reasons. First, how much an integrity commissioner gets involved in welfare is uncertain, particularly if the welfare-veterinary function is still embedded in the other half of the organisation – ie the so-called commercial area.
Second, such claims assume that the new system will be a good one and that it will be staffed with knowledgeable people. There is no guarantee whatever that such an outcome will be achieved. It is more a hope than a thoroughly considered response. Indeed, two states have already appointed Integrity Commissioners, both ex-policemen, with no special competence in welfare or even greyhound racing. These were political moves, no more, no less.
Third, as occurred in all the so-called independent reviews, it does not delve into the reasons for the failure of the original system. Was that system good, bad or indifferent? Were the people competent, lazy or did they have a laissez-faire attitude? What went wrong? It is not sufficient to simply say there were not enough people and they have all been sacked anyway. The absence of historical analysis means any future change will run the risk of repeating the old shortcomings.
Fourth, there are several aspects of greyhound racing that are screaming out for improvement and modernisation, including welfare. But any new welfare initiatives will be expensive, relative to the past, and so funds must be differently allocated in the future. To bring that about, it is important, even essential, that revenue and costs improve substantially over past efforts.
Fifth, a separate integrity group will certainly prove more expensive. That was one of the reasons for disbanding the comparable GHRRA organisation in NSW a few years ago. There was no compensating benefit to match the upfront cost.
I have not a shadow of doubt that a better result is achievable but not by otherwise continuing with the status quo. To simply raise welfare costs while maintaining existing revenue will obviously retard prize money, and in turn disadvantage participants who also are required to improve the integrity of their own operations.
As I instanced the other day, if a maintenance controller allows shoddy cars to go through the production line it means that either the employee or the system is at fault, or both. So find out which it is and change it.
Similarly, it has been well demonstrated that airlines which skimp on maintenance or training are the ones most likely to suffer crashes. Such outcomes invariably are a function of top management decisions and attitudes.
Greyhound bosses have clearly been at fault and the industry has suffered terrible crashes. So where else would you look for solutions?
In short, we need major reform and modern, business-like, accountable managers and management
structures to replace the current outmoded lot.
Incidentally, “Hugh” and others may not be aware that racing authorities are essentially bureaucratic institutions, run on a day to day basis by CEOs who have little or no direct authority or responsibility – formally, that rests with the board alone. CEOs are administrators, not managers. Having said that, it is noteworthy that GRNSW has already established fresh sets of principles and objectives to guide staff in all areas. Of course, a principle is one thing, practice another.
WA greyhound racing – good in parts
I have hesitated to comment on Perth's new Cannington track – with the exception of a prediction that a bend start for 600m races was a poor choice – pending some practical evidence. However, after a couple of months racing and a couple of feature events the picture is becoming clearer.
The corners seem quite good – but see (2) below.
The track strongly favours railers and good beginners – ie it's a leader's track.
The 600m bend start is a dud. It should be in a shute. (Ditto for Murray Bridge in SA).
In time I expect inside boxes to provide more than their share of winners – see (2) above.
Incidentally, the all-powerful Ozchase site never posts Cannington videos and prices until later in the week, which is a pain. However, the GWA website does the job right away but never shows field lists or times and margins. You can't win, can you?
(Yes, I know Queensland and Tasmania are no better. Tassie also shows its own videos but, like WA, does not list names or box numbers on the same page so you seldom know what you are looking at).
Great minds
On a completely unrelated subject, here is what a newspaper reader said about the way the world works.
“The ABC is a good example of what occurs when market forces do not apply – waste, unwanted products and general inefficiency”.
Racing, of course, has never accommodated market forces in its decision making. A committee of anywhere between three and twelve decides everything – therefore always being forced to use the lowest common denominator principle and seldom innovating anything. Consequently, it has waste, unwanted products and general inefficiency.
Dismal run
Stewards Report, Race 10, Shepparton April 25.
“Zoltina's Legacy was quick to begin. Nangar Fox and Specify collided soon after the start checking Specify. Dragon Empire checked off Zoltina's Legacy soon after the start. Kian's Hybrid checked off Nangar Fox on the first turn checking Zoltina's Legacy and Specify. Zoltina's Legacy, Nangar Fox and Specify collided approaching the home turn checking Nangar Fox. Kian's Hybrid checked off Dragon Empire approaching the winning post. Kian's Hybrid, Specify and Zoltina's Legacy collided approaching the winning post.”
First, Zoltina's Legacy, a $1.70 favourite in box 1, did get out of the box quickly but showed little pace at all after that (very unusual) and soon dropped well back. The above mentions of interference were all fairly modest and greatly exaggerated by the report. The bitch just plodded on, finishing eight lengths away in 3rd place.
Otherwise, stewards made no comment about the run, yet far better performances have been keenly queried. It may have been just a bad hair day – I would subscribe to that, given its excellent history – but punters deserved something better than what was written.
I’m not really sure why my qualifications are relevant. People around here seem to be obsessed with the source of the argument instead of the argument itself. A good argument stands on it’s own merits regardless of who is making it. But since you feel so “verballed” I am a researcher doing a PhD in animal physiology with a focus on metabolism, nutrition and phenotypic plasticity. Previously I did research that was similar but more focused on evolution. That’s my area, I don’t consider myself an expert on anything, but in some areas I have obviously more knowledge than the… Read more »
Hugh_ hi hugh, would love you to contact us @ Gone are the Dogs on Facebook if you could, look forward to speaking with you :D
Hugh – what is the point to animal physiology, as relating to greyhounds?
GATD! Another great org. NOT! Stay off our pages
Hugh_ Hi Hugh….Just as a matter of interest, how would you like it if someone walked into your home uninvited….doubt you’d enjoy the experience. As the old legal saying goes….’a man’s home is his castle’ and that’s why the Ag Gag Bill.
sparklingspear I’m not really sure whether you’re asking more broadly or asking me why I am mentioning that I have this background, I only mention my background because there has been a back and forth between me and Bruce in his last few articles, and this is the second time he has made mention of my unstated qualifications. Personally I didn’t want to bring it up because I think if you’re debating with someone you respond to their arguments, not the qualifications, background or anything else to do with the person making the argument (there are some exceptions, but I… Read more »
Hugh_ sparklingspear There are a lot of breeders worldwide preserving specific breeds Hugh!. Greyhounds included!
BJoe Hugh_ I understand that argument, but the difference is that in my home I’m not in charge of vast numbers of animals where I have a conflict of interest between my profits and their welfare. There’s a public interest issue here, when welfare breaches are exposed the public cares, and they are exposed with very high frequency. In general there are serious efforts to shield the public from the knowledge of what happens to animals in agriculture, and this is for fear that if educated the public will demand higher welfare standards which will lead to an economic downturn. Keeping… Read more »
BJoe Hugh_ sparklingspear I’m well aware of that. And that’s all well and good, and I have no problem with that in principle, I’m referring to the argument that it’s in the interest of greyhounds that greyhound racing remains a viable industry, and that the welfare cost that comes with it can be justified on that basis. When the truth is, preservation of the greyhound breed matters only to humans, the dogs don’t care. This was discussed in the previous two articles I believe.
Hugh_ BJoe sparklingspear Whether or not you know it Hugh, Greyhounds are generally well looked after and their health and wellbeing is at the forefront of owners and trainers. It doesn’t pay to mistreat them. Sure there is the odd incident popping up from time to time and when that happens, the anti brigade jump on it and flog the ‘cruelty’ angle to death.
Hugh_ Hugh, people will always put profits before welfare. It makes sense. I imagined that you were coming from the pig farming angle when you mentioned the Ag Gag Bill. Irrespective of what you have said, the ability to enter someone’s property without warrant, irrespective of the cause, should never, ever, be allowed. Drug dealers, paedophiles, murderers et al have that protection and that right should never be surrendered. The broader racing industry, including Greyhound Racing, is subject to powers of entry by ‘authorised’ personnel that would never stand a chance in a court of law. I love my animals… Read more »
Hugh_ sparklingspear Just as a matter of interest Hugh, what’s your stance on Thoroughbred and Standardbred racing given that they have similar issues as Greyhound Racing?
BJoe Hugh_ sparklingspear Similar stance for both codes. I realise lots of owners/trainers treat their dogs like royalty, please don’t interpret me as tarring everyone with a negative brush. That’s not my intention. And I’m fully supportive of a racing industry that has high welfare standards. The disagreement that arises between me and others is how high those standards should be and also what protections are necessary to ensure them. For example, in the eyes of someone like Bruce, the preservation of the greyhound breed is of such inherent importance and value that the disposal of non-performing dogs that are inevitably created… Read more »
BJoe Hugh_ “people will always put profits before welfare” This is completely dependent on the morality of the individual involved and how willing they are to compromise their own morals. Many people could make greater profit if they were prepared to be more indifferent to welfare costs. So I can’t agree with that statement. I also disagree that entry without warrant should never be allowed, and it is allowed all the time. Police can enter a property if they have reasonable belief a crime is being carried out or to prevent an imminent crime. And if you jumped your fence to… Read more »
Hugh_ sparklingspear Sounds like you’re incorrigible Hughy. Get into the real world. As most farmers say…..’animals only have one bad day in their lives’. I’ll leave it at that.
BJoe Hugh_ sparklingspear The complete opposite is true, I’m always open to changing my views if presented with a compelling argument. Unfortunately you haven’t offered one, presumably because you can’t come up with one. Instead you offer meaningless and obviously false statements. You don’t need to tell me that most farmers are indifferent to animal suffering, I’m very aware of this, and that’s exactly why they would say something like that which is obviously false and based on old fashioned ideas that humans are the one special species placed here by a non-existent god. Congratulations on your choice to be ignorant and… Read more »
Hugh_ sparklingspear Hugh, I haven’t made any false statements and I certainly don’t mistreat my animals, which are not limited to Greyhounds, be they fast or slow.. I just understand the order of things in this world. Presently, I see a tendency for people to ‘humanise’ their animals, be they dogs, cats, pigs or goats. Most refer to them as their ‘children’, which in itself, is sad as they seem to be lowering themselves to their level rather than making babies of their own to love. Sadder still is that as a result of this ‘misplaced love’, there are individuals who… Read more »
BJoe Hugh_ sparklingspear The false statement you made is that animals only have one bad day in their life. That’s obviously false in the context you used it (farm animals), the aforementioned pigs from high intensity farms being the obvious example. And the false statements just keep coming. Recognising that animals are sentient and intelligent is not “humanising”. That’s pure hard science. It’s our commonality of biology that tells us animals experience suffering. Our understanding of evolution and brain anatomy and function is what allows us to determine that animals have significant cognitive abilities and also experience much of the same emotions… Read more »
Hugh_ sparklingspear Hugh, you are one sick puppy. Now get off this site.
BJoe Hugh_ sparklingspear You asked, so I answered. You don’t like my answers? Too bad. I’m a sick puppy because I care about welfare? You’re against animal welfare? Wow.
Hugh_ BJoe sparklingspear Go on Hugh, tell us his name.
Hugh, my ? was , what do you hope to find,achieve, that relates to greyhounds, or even any canine?
It does appear tho, that you’ve had a long long exposure to Uni speak (lol)
Reinforcing your position with comments by a compliance professional. As a general observation, the greyhound regulatory approach to compliance since the ‘live baiting’ publicity is that compliance just involves enforcement with a big stick to all participants. This is reflected by a recruitment focus on enforcement backgrounds rather than professional compliance backgrounds at both Board and management levels. This focus is at odds with modern compliance management and international best practice principles for compliance. Compliance ‘tools’ such as education, support, communication, and culture change that are necessary for the future of greyhound racing are at best neglected, if not forgotten. … Read more »
Hugh_ There were, and continue to be, powers to enter and inspect, particularly at registered training properties which is where the live baiting offences occurred. There was no requirement or practice for visits to be announced ahead of time. In that respect, the new legislation in Victoria really just gives similar powers to welfare inspectors as for RSPCA inspectors. There are human rights implications for entry onto private properties (as opposed to registered training properties), in that arbitrary entry where there is no reasonable suspicion can represent a breach of the Charter of Human Rights & Responsibilities Act, and is… Read more »
Bruce its hard to not agree with you, as for the antis, is it not true they are only a little insect that only stings for a short while before it goes away ?
I’m not really sure why my qualifications are relevant. People around here seem to be obsessed with the source of the argument instead of the argument itself. A good argument stands on it’s own merits regardless of who is making it. But since you feel so “verballed” I am a researcher doing a PhD in animal physiology with a focus on metabolism, nutrition and phenotypic plasticity. Previously I did research that was similar but more focused on evolution. That’s my area, I don’t consider myself an expert on anything, but in some areas I have obviously more knowledge than the… Read more »
Hugh_ hi hugh, would love you to contact us @ Gone are the Dogs on Facebook if you could, look forward to speaking with you :D
Hugh – what is the point to animal physiology, as relating to greyhounds?
GATD! Another great org. NOT! Stay off our pages
Hugh_ Hi Hugh….Just as a matter of interest, how would you like it if someone walked into your home uninvited….doubt you’d enjoy the experience. As the old legal saying goes….’a man’s home is his castle’ and that’s why the Ag Gag Bill.
sparklingspear I’m not really sure whether you’re asking more broadly or asking me why I am mentioning that I have this background, I only mention my background because there has been a back and forth between me and Bruce in his last few articles, and this is the second time he has made mention of my unstated qualifications. Personally I didn’t want to bring it up because I think if you’re debating with someone you respond to their arguments, not the qualifications, background or anything else to do with the person making the argument (there are some exceptions, but I… Read more »
Hugh_ sparklingspear There are a lot of breeders worldwide preserving specific breeds Hugh!. Greyhounds included!
BJoe Hugh_ I understand that argument, but the difference is that in my home I’m not in charge of vast numbers of animals where I have a conflict of interest between my profits and their welfare. There’s a public interest issue here, when welfare breaches are exposed the public cares, and they are exposed with very high frequency. In general there are serious efforts to shield the public from the knowledge of what happens to animals in agriculture, and this is for fear that if educated the public will demand higher welfare standards which will lead to an economic downturn. Keeping… Read more »
BJoe Hugh_ sparklingspear I’m well aware of that. And that’s all well and good, and I have no problem with that in principle, I’m referring to the argument that it’s in the interest of greyhounds that greyhound racing remains a viable industry, and that the welfare cost that comes with it can be justified on that basis. When the truth is, preservation of the greyhound breed matters only to humans, the dogs don’t care. This was discussed in the previous two articles I believe.
Hugh_ BJoe sparklingspear Whether or not you know it Hugh, Greyhounds are generally well looked after and their health and wellbeing is at the forefront of owners and trainers. It doesn’t pay to mistreat them. Sure there is the odd incident popping up from time to time and when that happens, the anti brigade jump on it and flog the ‘cruelty’ angle to death.
Hugh_ Hugh, people will always put profits before welfare. It makes sense. I imagined that you were coming from the pig farming angle when you mentioned the Ag Gag Bill. Irrespective of what you have said, the ability to enter someone’s property without warrant, irrespective of the cause, should never, ever, be allowed. Drug dealers, paedophiles, murderers et al have that protection and that right should never be surrendered. The broader racing industry, including Greyhound Racing, is subject to powers of entry by ‘authorised’ personnel that would never stand a chance in a court of law. I love my animals… Read more »
Hugh_ sparklingspear Just as a matter of interest Hugh, what’s your stance on Thoroughbred and Standardbred racing given that they have similar issues as Greyhound Racing?
BJoe Hugh_ sparklingspear Similar stance for both codes. I realise lots of owners/trainers treat their dogs like royalty, please don’t interpret me as tarring everyone with a negative brush. That’s not my intention. And I’m fully supportive of a racing industry that has high welfare standards. The disagreement that arises between me and others is how high those standards should be and also what protections are necessary to ensure them. For example, in the eyes of someone like Bruce, the preservation of the greyhound breed is of such inherent importance and value that the disposal of non-performing dogs that are inevitably created… Read more »
BJoe Hugh_ “people will always put profits before welfare” This is completely dependent on the morality of the individual involved and how willing they are to compromise their own morals. Many people could make greater profit if they were prepared to be more indifferent to welfare costs. So I can’t agree with that statement. I also disagree that entry without warrant should never be allowed, and it is allowed all the time. Police can enter a property if they have reasonable belief a crime is being carried out or to prevent an imminent crime. And if you jumped your fence to… Read more »
Hugh_ sparklingspear Sounds like you’re incorrigible Hughy. Get into the real world. As most farmers say…..’animals only have one bad day in their lives’. I’ll leave it at that.
BJoe Hugh_ sparklingspear The complete opposite is true, I’m always open to changing my views if presented with a compelling argument. Unfortunately you haven’t offered one, presumably because you can’t come up with one. Instead you offer meaningless and obviously false statements. You don’t need to tell me that most farmers are indifferent to animal suffering, I’m very aware of this, and that’s exactly why they would say something like that which is obviously false and based on old fashioned ideas that humans are the one special species placed here by a non-existent god. Congratulations on your choice to be ignorant and… Read more »
Hugh_ sparklingspear Hugh, I haven’t made any false statements and I certainly don’t mistreat my animals, which are not limited to Greyhounds, be they fast or slow.. I just understand the order of things in this world. Presently, I see a tendency for people to ‘humanise’ their animals, be they dogs, cats, pigs or goats. Most refer to them as their ‘children’, which in itself, is sad as they seem to be lowering themselves to their level rather than making babies of their own to love. Sadder still is that as a result of this ‘misplaced love’, there are individuals who… Read more »
BJoe Hugh_ sparklingspear The false statement you made is that animals only have one bad day in their life. That’s obviously false in the context you used it (farm animals), the aforementioned pigs from high intensity farms being the obvious example. And the false statements just keep coming. Recognising that animals are sentient and intelligent is not “humanising”. That’s pure hard science. It’s our commonality of biology that tells us animals experience suffering. Our understanding of evolution and brain anatomy and function is what allows us to determine that animals have significant cognitive abilities and also experience much of the same emotions… Read more »
Hugh_ sparklingspear Hugh, you are one sick puppy. Now get off this site.
BJoe Hugh_ sparklingspear You asked, so I answered. You don’t like my answers? Too bad. I’m a sick puppy because I care about welfare? You’re against animal welfare? Wow.
Hugh_ sparklingspear What’s his name Hugh!
Hugh_ BJoe sparklingspear Go on Hugh, tell us his name.
Hugh, my ? was , what do you hope to find,achieve, that relates to greyhounds, or even any canine?
It does appear tho, that you’ve had a long long exposure to Uni speak (lol)
Reinforcing your position with comments by a compliance professional. As a general observation, the greyhound regulatory approach to compliance since the ‘live baiting’ publicity is that compliance just involves enforcement with a big stick to all participants. This is reflected by a recruitment focus on enforcement backgrounds rather than professional compliance backgrounds at both Board and management levels. This focus is at odds with modern compliance management and international best practice principles for compliance. Compliance ‘tools’ such as education, support, communication, and culture change that are necessary for the future of greyhound racing are at best neglected, if not forgotten. … Read more »
Hugh_ There were, and continue to be, powers to enter and inspect, particularly at registered training properties which is where the live baiting offences occurred. There was no requirement or practice for visits to be announced ahead of time. In that respect, the new legislation in Victoria really just gives similar powers to welfare inspectors as for RSPCA inspectors. There are human rights implications for entry onto private properties (as opposed to registered training properties), in that arbitrary entry where there is no reasonable suspicion can represent a breach of the Charter of Human Rights & Responsibilities Act, and is… Read more »